Yeah, I can vouch for the KELe manuals… have several and will be getting the Beretta 92 to add to the collection. 
Not great triggers though, but to be expected from a manual.
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Same with the KEle kimbers.
The silver looked tacky and cheap plastic silver,
but the darker model looked much nicer.
Might be the same with the ppk’s.
NOW THEY MAKE ONE GODDAAMMIIITTT
I just got over my love of it of couuurseee
if its any consolation…
Looks like they’ve already sold out…!!! 
Actually…if you simply must…
GBU are still showing in stock… albeit at a slightly higher price…
Yep got a woody lol
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Ok…
quick Real Steel question here…
Looking at getting a .223, I haven’t owned one before.
Looking for good quality / value, Cleaver firearms is closest.
Will be doing mostly range shooting at belmont, with perhaps the very occasional hunting trip.
The Ruger American centrefire is blued, synth stock and $850.
I like CZ, so i had a quick look if they do .223
I saw the CZ 600 Trail, and it looks the part.
Legal in QLD, not NSW.
$1635, so more exxy.
Would i be better off, with the more traditional ruger, or go for the CZ.??
Also, good scopes, for the .223?
Thanks.!
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Haven’t owned/shot either of these newer rifles, all a bit flasher than our old hand—me-down family farm rifles……. but can only attest that the Ruger classic style rifle would be much more comfortable to carry and accurate shoot than the Military style CZ 
“Looks” factor aside, i think the main drawcard of the CZ, would be …
Less overall weight…(probs not so important at the range), and
Compactness.
Smaller size would be beneficial, for storage and transport.
Accuracy would be similar, i have been told that most .223’s achieve around a 1 inch group, at 100m.
What type of scope, do most people go for, on .223.?
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Oooo nice one.
The Ruger american are a good budget rifle. Action is a bit gritty but the rest is rock solid.
The CZ are better quality. Action like glass. Also shorter action than the long action Ruger.
Howa .223 is another great option. Short mini action. Sub moa with those.
Scope at least a 3-9x40 Bushnell Banner and up the magnification if you can afford it to whatever your heart desires. Vortex, but they are pricey.
Cleavers are good as they import all their own products and don’t rely on NIOA like the rest have to. Been very helpful when I’ve shopped there.
Good choice on caliber too for a centrefire. Inherently accurate, efficient and take out all game you will find in Australia. But importantly especially atm ammo availability and price.
Happy shopping. I love going shopping 
I’m still running a 4-16x40 Tasco on mine. Good for zooming in at 300 yards.
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Cleavers it literally a 5 min drive away…
Feel like a kid in a toy store, whenever you walk in…!!
Pity Belmont range is across the river…
I wish you could “try before you buy”…
You know how it feels, and if you like it, after 50 or so rounds…
I’m kinda leaning towards the CZ.
I have a cz455 in .22, so i have the "classic rifle " sorted.
Quite accurate too, and the action is super smooth.
The compactness is a plus, just wanna see if there is wobble, in the stock.
The blurb on cleavers says “changeable calibres”, as well…!
.223 is powerful enough for hunting most game, relatively affordable for a centrefire, very flat trajectory over the first 200m ( which is about the limit you’d try to take game anyway, with this calibre).
I have an old .303 , given to me by my Ex’s Dad, before he passed.
Its a lovely old rifle, ex military target rifle, i believe, but man , that ammo ain’t cheap…
I’ll use my stage 3 tax cuts, to pay for it…!! ( dont get me started…“my word is my bond”…!!)
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I hear ya on all points.
Go in to the shop, sounds like you are experienced. Get a feel for them or do they not let you fondle them anymore lol
And the price of 3 o , phew yea. I nearly fell over at the last lot of 12g and .22 I bought before xmas. Double 
And it was the last they had for months.
I’d be leaning towards the CZ I’ll see if I can find any info on that model. Interested to know myself.
Looks mostly good. I dunno about the 2moa thing should be better than that.
Kinda keen to spend my stage 3 tax cuts on one handy ute rifle for ze vermin… oh wait a minute…
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I read some of the comments , in the you tube vid.
Owners were claiming, 1 inch groups from their CZ 600’s.
Ive not heavily looked into “interchangable barrel / calibre” rifles before, but that could be one positive for this.
They seem to be pretty good, of course accuracy is the most important feature, but they seem to be capable of that.
Having a .223 / .243 / .300 , from one platform sounds pretty good.
@jazzyward can let us know, when she gets her license…I seem to remember her ordering a multi calibre CZ.?? (.177 WMR, .22, .22Mag)
Something compact, in the farm ute, would be good…
We should probs start a "real steel " thread…
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The price of ammo is ridiculous these days.
I was toying around with getting a Cat H and doing a bit of target popping up the road at Murrumba Pistol Club.
The price of pistols was a surprise, easily affordable. It was the price of the ammo that put the kybosh on it for me… and that was just .22LR
The CZ rimfire swappable from .22LR to .17HMR which is not available anymore been dropped with the 457 line for Australia as it did not sell.
You can still get the swap barrel sets for the 455 and 457 line from Cleavers but actual whole model seems to have disappeared from Aus shelves.
Yep rgr if you want to go real steel thread.
I half arsed started writing a second reply to my original that covered my experience with old family rifles, but pretty much everything was fitted with old 60’s/70’s/80’s TASCO/BUSHNELL/FOCAL/LEUPOLD Scopes 
They are all of obviously varying degrees of precision, quality and accuracy…… but they all do the same job at the end of the day for target acquisition 
I can only recommend traditional types of rifles for their ergonomics and heavier weight that gives a much more solid and precise shooting posture over janky lightweight Military Assault Rifle types of designs
.223 is a perfect combination of distance, accuracy, hitting power and cost effectiveness in 99.9% of rural requirements.
This calibre will cover every single situation between real life farm culling and precision target shooting no matter which side of the fence you are on in either use.
Certainly requires much larger calibre gear for more precise bigger game/range use, but that’s a completely different story as to having the right tool for the job at hand
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Slightly differing, point of view…
I have a Anschutz .22 break barrel air rifle, Dad gave me, when i was 12…
Fu@@in heavy…to hold , transport, carry, shoot…your arms get tired, and wander…
I have a PCP air rifle, .25…same critisism , as above.
My CZ .22 rifle, is so much lighter, and compact.
I’d rather lug that around, all day…
If a .223 rifle is small, light, and compact…
Thats a big thumbs up, in my book…
As i said, i’d like to try both…
a lighter rifle, may be better than a heavier rifle, with a more solid stock…
The latest old original design .223’s with polymer stocks/handguards are a massive improvement from the old timber equipped rifles
I can only recommend through shooting a mates modern polymer .223 with a night vision scope only a couple of weekends ago, that they are extremely comfortable ergonomics wise that provides a very comfortable, stable, accurate shooting position towards any target
Looking at that CZ, it sends shivers up my spine in regards to the stock, handguard shape and high centre of gravity barrel location.
I have never had the opportunity to fire one, but I am uncomfortable just looking at the images of their designs as being an effective/practical/accurate/easily handled weapon 
Like I said earlier all comes down to personal preference. It’s yours so set it up to what you want and suits you
100% Agreed!
Not having handled one, I can only go off of looks and specifications……. but at the same time being an old school Hot Rodder that appreciates a classic smooth shape that has been proven for decades as to being the ducks guts of well crafted equipment
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Like i said…
I wish we could try, before we buy…
everyone has different preferences…and what they’re happy with…
30+ rounds, down range , is usually enough to get a feel…
befret of that, you just have to buy, and then find out for yourself…
Psst… hey squiddy… wanna buy a M-60…!!